Saturday, August 8, 2009

NZ Vegan Podcast Episode 34 - Part 1 of my interview with special guest Francis Glass, abolitionist vegan coordinator of Animal Liberation Youth

Listen HERE

Part one of my interview with special guest Francis Glass, an 18 year old abolitionist vegan from Australia,and coordinator of Animal Liberation Youth, which is part of the abolitionist vegan advocacy group Animal Liberation Victoria. We talk about activism, vegan education, the counterproductiveness and elitism of welfare reform, and emphasize the fact that the abolitionist movement is part of the peace movement. You can find information about this abolitionist activism in Australia by going to and
Stay tuned for part two...


  1. I don't think that campaigning against KFC is abolitionist activism even if it does not advocate CAK because focusing on suppliers of animal products is based on the notion, and sends the public message, that they, and not those who create the demand, are the problem.
    This notion is exactly why those campaigns attract nonvegan activists. Working together with them reinforces the erroneous assumption that someone can do something to fight animal exploitation without being vegan. And I wouldn't want a nonvegan to distribute vegan literature unless that person could be prevented from talking about veganism because whatever she might say would be deeply confused and confusing. Or can you imagine someone who is not vegan spreading a coherent and consistent message about why we should be vegan?

  2. Thanks Karin, you have of course raised some legitimate points and concerns and I will definitely invite Francis back on the show to discuss them further, as these are the kinds of things that need to be talked about.

  3. This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

  4. You may be relatively new to veganism and podcasting Elizabeth, but you have a remarkable talent for attracting great guests. I found Francis to be articulate and thoughtful and I loved his stories. Knowing there are young people of his caliber gives me hope for the future of the abolitionist movement.

  5. NOTE:
    the following comment was made by Gordon (see above) — I re-posted it here because there was a swear word in the original comment - no offense meant Gordon! - I am trying to keep this blog young kid and grandma friendly, or super-religious-and-against-swear-words-friendly. I personally have absolutely no objection to expletives whatsoever, I use them all the time, and I think they are over rated and over ostracized, however just because I know some people are still offended by those words, and I want EVERY SINGLE HUMAN BEING ON THE PLANET to learn about abolition and veganism, I am making allowances for the non-swearers on this planet, or parents who moderate what their kids read.
    Swearers - PLEASE don't feel I am discriminating against you. Send me a personal email and swear away! I won't mind at all.
    Ok, here is the comment that Gordon made (minus one little word):

    "...I agree with Karin Hilpisch.

    I think protesting people while they eat isn't a good idea.

    Something interesting I saw was on Francis' Facebook profile, in one of his pictures, he was at a some sort of jumps-races demo, and he was wearing a leather jacket. Am I the only one who thinks that is messed up? It's saying it's okay to wear the skin of animals, but it's not okay for horces to participate in jumps races. This is simply bizarre. Btw I mentioned this because I thought it was giving people a confusing message, not to put Francis down. He's done infinity times more activism than me..."

  6. Thanks Cyndi, I think it is very important to introduce the world to abolitionist vegans and break all the stereotypes out there. Thank you so much for your support and for listening!

  7. Thanks Gordon
    As we know Francis is a vegan, in fact he is an abolitionist vegan and because of that I am sure of his integrity, I am absolutely convinced of it in fact.
    There are many products that look like leather, or it may be a photo taken before Francis became vegan, or it may be an item of clothing he still owns from before he went vegan. I am not sure you considered those things before you left your comment, also I would suggest that in the interest of solidarity that we try not to jump to negative conclusions about each other on blog comments, especially without having all the facts. I had the choice to not publish the comment, but as I am open and honest person who welcomes discussion, (as long as there are no swear words hee hee), I will not censor anybody's discussions (except for replacing the swear words). Also, I appreciate your support regarding the activism.
    And, of course, thanks for listening!

  8. It's definitely leather. It's pregan.

    I'm not an abolitionist. My understanding is that they oppose animal products outright, whether they be pregan or out of a dumpster. So I found it particularly strange that he wore the jacket to a demo. He's begging to be called a hypocrite by the animal exploiters.

    I don't mean to be rude or negative. I just thought it was interesting.

    I enjoyed the last two episodes. Perhaps you could have him, and the person he talked about (Zoe) on at the same time.

  9. Gordon, who is an animal exploiter?

    Just kidding, that's an inside joke to us abolitionists who have been having a lot of discussions lately about these things. It is a good thing to ask yourself though: who is an animal exploiter?

    There has been great commentary by Gary Francione regarding that very question, and I think it is extremely important concept to explore, especially someone like yourself who seems really interested in the concept of abolition and in all that is going on regarding that, and what it means etc etc. Keep listening! I recommend listening to the Abolitionist Approach Commentary also, which is a new podcast by Gary Francione. You can find it here: AbolitionistApproachCommentary

    His next episode will be about "pets", which you might find very interesting as a 'freegan' (if I am not mistaken in applying that term to you, I think you told me once you are freegan?).

    P.S thank you for not swearing this time. :-)

  10. haha :D

    Regarding being negative - perhaps I am being "devisive" ;)

    I'm familiar with the whole "animal exploiters". I was really referring to the counter protesters.

    I just listened to his podcast on pets.

    Even if somebody rejects the idea of animal rights, I don't believe we will ever get rid of the associated problems, such as over population of animals and the mistreatment of animals. It is therefore selfish of people to support an inherently problematic "industry".

    Anyway, prenancy and childbirth can be extremely stressful and painful.

    I really hate it when people say "but they are stunned before they are killed" (regarding food animals). To that I say "so what?". They suffer horribly at different times during their life, including prenancy and labor - which, no matter what you do, will always involve suffering. Though that's for mammals. I dunno about for birds.

    Yes, I try to be freegan. I still buy stuff though. I consider it to be the natural extention of veganism. It just belongs more to the living-without-cruelty movement than the animal rights movement.

    I'm a consequentialist though (Gary obviously isn't). So I see no ethical objections to eating anything that would otherwise go to waste. It's the domestication, suffering, and murder I am opposed to -- not the meat, milk and eggs.

    I think utilising the bodys of dead humans, whether for organ transplants or meat/by products is a good idea. But that doesn't mean I support the enslavement, suffering and murder of human animals.

    Though freeganism is more than just eating out of garbage bins. But in practice, it is mainly about reusing and recycling things. For example; the monitor I am currently looking at I picked up off a footpath.

    I still don't eat meat, milk or eggs (whole). But I'd be happy to eat a muffin made with egg and milk, or a cheese roll. Though this is a personal objection (I find them repugnant now, especially meat, knowing it is a carved up animal), not an ethical objection. It's important to distinguish between the two.

    I've gone on a billion tangents here. Sorry.

    My main point was that going to a demo wearing a leather jacket - whether it be pregen or not - is stupicuous.

  11. Gordon - you used the 'd' word!
    No swearing remember? hee hee